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Asking LGBTQ+ people only:

What's your view of the word "queer" in the context of describing LGBTQ+ people?

Boosts appreciated for sample size :)

@delve oh shoot i accidentally voted. Sorry 😳

@jeff It's okay. One bad vote probably shouldn't affect the end results too much. Polls are never perfect anyway.

@jeff @delve same here, I've overseen one word!

OK, LGBTQ+ is a little bit complicated.
Also the variation LGBTQI

@jeff @delve maybe it's not easy for not queer people, which respect queer people, not to vote.

@delve

I love it for myself even though sometimes it's hard for me to claim it because my experience of it is so subtle. I wouldn't use it for someone else unless I know they use it for themselves, because I know that for many people it was never reclaimed and sometimes still hurts.

I think it's reclamation is beautiful and should keep happening.

@Phoenix_Borealis @delve yeah this is my opinion. i love to describe myself as that and occasionally ill say it to cover the WHOLE of 2slgbtqia but i wont refer to a specific person as that, and ill stop using it as a descriptor if someone is uncomfortable (not for myself but id cut back on stating that around them)

@delve my only problem is the increased visibility gets a lot of perfectly well-meaning people outside of the community throwing it around like the word is weightless and randomly using it at me and that puts me extremely on edge c:

but I have no idea how to fix that without harming people's ability to self-identify so neutral is probably the best answer

@nisima Thank you for the response! I appreciate it! :)

@delve places/communities that label themselves as queer feel safer for me as an aspec, since way too many people think "LGBTQ" with q meaning questioning is the full acronym

@delve
When I was a boy, there wasn't even a word; not really. But I was seen as insufficiently masculine, so others would take me behind the gym building and shout, literally shout, "why are you such a fem?!"

I was tough enough that I could have simply beat their faces in. But I didn't want to hurt others and so I was a "fem". My advice to others today is, come what may, beat them to a pulp. Pacificism is for "fems". Fight.

I'm not "LGBTQ+" but "queerment" is endearment. Stand proud.

@delve I'm voting positive; though I feel like it's highly context sensitive. Even within the example context provided.

Straight folks of a certain generation still do use it as a pejorative when describing LGBTQ+ people.

@trashheap @delve it took my parents a long time to feel comfortable saying it. They're right in that generation of 55-65 year olds where it was a common pejorative.

@delve While I don't deny that queer has been used as a slur, for me it's a short hand way for me to describe myself as 'not straight'. Which is really helpful if I don't feel like explaining what pansexual, demisexual, and demigirl are.

@delve if someone wants to use it for themselves that’s fine. I’m so so on anyone who isn’t in someway lgbt+ using it… and I don’t like being called it, even if it fits.

I won’t cause a fuss about it, I’m happy people have reclaimed the slur for themselves, but it’s a long way from not hurting.

As is, I think it’s too mainstream to get people to not use it so I don’t bother trying

@delve but i bristle at seeing news call us that where as if a friend did I wouldn’t even say I’m not fond of it for myself

I never wanna discourse or debate about it tho, that’s just my feelings on it, and I did use it for a time before I had to deal with some really bad homo/transphobia for a few months and lost my willingness and happiness to describe myself that way

@delve and I don’t call others that unless I know it’s what they prefer

Shrugs

@delve unfortunately around where we live it tends to have negative connotations, we personally don't mind it as long as it it use correctly, but at least where we have been it is not used correctly...

@delve I voted "neutral", but more specifically: I like using the word for myself. However, I'd say overall use of the word is based on context.

Within the community, it's positive (as long as used when you know the other party is "okay" with the word) From outside the community, it can come across as negative. :blobcatgooglyshrug:

@delve I think there is an element of generational difference. I think older people often had it used as a slur against us. I think younger people are more okay with it. But don't assume that everyone is okay with it, or has reclaimed it. I think it's a more in your face term, like middle finger to the establishment. Again, I could be showing my age (mid 50's).

@delve oh jeez i am sorry. I saw this on mobile and i didn't realize it was a /poll/

@homodachi No worries! I appreciate the elaborations :)

@delve Follow up #poll for us only:

Which do you think is more inclusive?

@PaulaToThePeople I would actually claim that the "queer" is more inclusive than any acronym that explicitly lists labels and then just puts an "everything else" symbol at the end. Similar to how I prefer the original rainbow flag (maybe with that one extra stripe too) over the "new" pride flag which, by explicitly including certain pride flags, feels exclusive for those not represented.

@kescher I'm definitely with you on the word queer and I get your point with the pride flag, I just really like the colors of the "new" or "progressive" pride flag.

@kescher @PaulaToThePeople Also the acronym makes me feel I need to choose my letters/labels to be part of the community? The fact queer is less precise helps me to feel welcome even if I am questioning my identity or if it is fluid.

@kescher

@piguicorn posted:

"Also the acronym makes me feel I need to choose my letters/labels to be part of the community? The fact queer is less precise helps me to feel welcome even if I am questioning my identity or if it is fluid."

@PaulaToThePeople @delve Is that a typo, or did that beautiful but infuriating letter soup really get larger.
OK, so there's one A that I know. Asexual, which I fall into. You could argue aromantic should get its own, but I haven't seen all that many people arguing about that, so I think we can coexist under the same pointy roof peacefully.
Then there's ally, which (to me) is sort of like putting a W in that BIPOC. Non LGBTQIA/queer folks often are awesome, that's for sure. I thought I was an ally myself, for a time. But do they deserve a letter in this already long "word", either another A or the same one (which kind of hides ace folks from view)? :ms_shrug:
But suppose they do get the letter. That's 3 A's. What's the 4th?

@PaulaToThePeople ... Ah. All the facepalms. :ms_facepalm:
Right. There are indeed some who think that doesn't fall under the T. But then again, that would mean there'd have to be a separate N for us as well ...

And there's the question of whether the Q is for questioning or queer, because if it is for the latter, the poll becomes "What is more inclusive? This long list of identities, or one of the identities from the list?"
Language is complicated. :ms_sweat_smile:
@delve

@delve 6 hours in the fucking Sunday morning.
Too early for exact thinking.
I've overseen the first »Asking LGBTQ+ people only:«
And important, that »only«
So, I've made a voting, and be not Your target group, because I'm approx 98% straight,
but I respect queer people *(gn)

@delve We like it for ourselves, but specific context and usage matters. If someone is using it in a derogatory manner, that's a different situation from someone using it neutrally or positively. It also matters whether the people it's being used to refer to are okay with that.

Overall we have a positive opinion, but the usage really does matter and we answered neutral because of that.

@delve I like the idea of reclaiming slurs and "queer" is easier to say in conversation than "LGBT+"

@delve @thufie it’s highly dependent for me on who is saying and in what way? If a cishet is using it, I’m suspicious at best.

@delve I acknowledge that a subset of the LGBTQIA+ community, especially older generations who were more likely to have been around when it was regularly used as a slur, still see it as a negative term, and that makes sense, as undoing those negative connotations can be hard, but I also think it's worth reclaiming by anyone who has capacity to do so. L
Not to mention that it's a nice approximate shorthand, in lieu of "rainbow community" or "LGBTQIA+ community"

@delve I love the label queer especially because transphobic gatekeepers tend to hate it. They want to be able to sort the "acceptable" lgbtqia+ individuals (generally, cis) from the "unacceptable" (generally, trans) and *fuck that*.

@delve

I'm not a native English speaker

I'm a cis gay man

Am I queer ? I'm not sure

As far as I understand, queer is a superset of "gay"

So, yes, I'm gay and that makes me queer too

But I'm not sure about this, I may be wrong, as far as I know

@abbienormal Cis gay men would fall under the umbrella of "queer," yes. "Queer" generally means anyone who isn't cisgender-heterosexual. It can also sometimes be used to refer to gender non-conforming folks, like crossdressers or drag queens, but not always.

@delve when i was growing up, “gay” was what you called people who were bad at call of duty, or posted in the comments of youtube videos you didn't like. in addition to its positive meanings, it was a slur and people used it as a slur.

as a matter of fact, pretty much *every* term used to describe LGBTQ people has also been used as either a slur or a pathology at some point in time, and generally through to the present day.

why is “queer” always treated as if it were unique in this respect? you could just as easily ask people's opinions on describing gay women with the word “lesbian”

@delve (the answer, from what i have heard, is that queer culture is explicitly trans-affirming, and TERFs)

@delve i see it as positive! it used to be derogatory but now it's used to celebrate our differnces and uniqueness :_gaysparkle:

@delve Just wanna note that the word queer, in the form "kuir" has been adopted by turkish LGBTQIA+ communities as well. I doubt it's ever been used as a slur here tho, as the word is mostly used within the community itself.

@delve I'm not strongly identifying with one single label on the LGBTQIA+ spectrum but weakly with multiple, so queer is the only label I can realistically give myself without launching into an explanation

@delve depending on the time, who says it and how i suppose..

@delve Just for the record - I’m old enough that “queer” was a slur when I was growing up and it makes me very cross to see exclusionists try to turn it back into a slur again

@delve the word "queer" makes it easier to describe what i am without having to rush to choose a label

@delve This poll does not account for the history of the word. Queer is positive *because* it is negative. People were dying and the word was reclaimed as a way of saying "fuck you, I'm your worst nightmare. I do not want you to accept me into your world, I will build my own world made of things you despise."

@delve hmm, I voted already, but now I’m wondering about the difference between being described and self-description

@delve I use it for myself and with friends and other people online that dont mind using it.
I'm aware of the history behind it but I definitely think its the lingual and cultural disassociation (am croatian) that makes me more 'easy-going' with it.
Noone ever called me a queer because we just dont have the word for it nor anything close to its broad implication in my language.

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